A conversation on Critical Race Theory with Reginald “Reggie” Bess

Alex: Critical Race Theory. I’ll sign it as “CRT” for short. There is a lot of discussion on the news among politicians, lawmakers, and members of Congress on whether they support or are opposed to the idea of schools teaching CRT. Can you provide a summary of what CRT is?

Reginald Bess: Okay, I will explain. CRT, Critical Race Theory, to be perfectly honest, I didn’t really know about CRT. I found out about it when Governor Kemp proposed to ban the teaching of CRT. I will admit that I thought CRT, because of the word, “race,” was centered on anti-Black racism alone. But when I read, it was not the case. I read this book.

[Reggie shows a book with the title, “Critical Race Theory: An Introduction.”]

When I read it, I saw that it was different. How did CRT come about? In 1989, there were three writers who were lawyers and college professors from New York who went to a conference in Madison, Wisconsin. They talked about CRT and had a specific focus on three parts: race, racism, and power. So they did not only focus on anti-Black racism, but on various areas such as the economy, history, groups such as Black people, Asian people, Spanish people, Native Americans, and various others, on emotions, on immigration policy, on LG — excuse me — LGBTQ discrimination, and many different areas.

Also, in law school, they usually teach CRT. Lawyers tend to use CRT, especially if they have BIPOC clients, they want to use those arguments in courts.

So, they talk about America and race. They want to know what Americans’ views on race are. This doesn’t include what (the authors) views on race are personally, but on how Americans view race. They started with talking about the concept of “white.” They said white is equivalent to “pure.” Purity. Like a wedding dress. It’s white, so it’s a positive thing, a pure thing. A dove is positive. So they were innocently colonized to think that a different color means it’s a negative thing. So that’s why when they look at BIPOC people, they see something negative. Why is that? It’s because they grew up seeing white, white, white, so they are used to it, and they are shocked to see something different. That’s an innocent colonization.

So, I want to share a little about CRT. (The authors) studied different cases, legal cases, to figure out why some were successful and some were not. For example, an author named Derrick Bell focused his research on Brown v. Board of Education. He wanted to understand why they quickly gave equal rights. Why is that? He wanted to know why, so he analyzed it. That was interesting to me. Understand this, all the theorists who studied race have different viewpoints. Does this mean all of them have the same opinion? No. Some have a positive view, some have a negative view. It varies.

I also want to share about Latinos. In Arizona, in their school system, there was a group that wanted to form a study about Latinos because they wanted to learn about their identities and history. But the state of Arizona banned it. It was blocked. Wow. I also learned that Latino nationalists reject the term, “Hispanic” because it comes from Spain. So they knew their history and was resistant. That was interesting to me.

So, here’s one last story I want to share. There were two Chinese-Americans, in 1982, who were murdered by people in Detroit who built cars. Why were they killed? It was because they were from China and in 1982, they also built cars that outperformed American-made cars. So they were angry about it. The result of the two people who murdered them — they never went to jail. They only got probation. I’m not sure how you sign probation, but this is how I sign it. So they never went to jail even though they committed a murder. So this case was studied and I thought it was interesting.

So, now I’ve explained three different areas they focused on. But there are also six different areas they analyzed: race, the disproportionate amount of Black men who are in jail compared with how many are in college, hate speech, which is when someone from another country who works in the U.S. are barred from speaking their native language. That’s wrong because their identity is deprived. It is also a violation of their First Amendment rights. The fourth area is affirmative action. It is when organizations hire BIPOC individuals because of their skills, to make sure that they receive equal treatment like white people do. It doesn’t mean to hire someone just because they are Black or Brown to meet quotas. That’s wrong. The fifth area is globalization. It is when jobs in factories in cities are thrown out in favor of moving them to other countries because of technology. That hurts BIPOC people because they had skills, incomes, and jobs. Also — immigration policy — in 1965, the U.S. would strictly control who could come into the country to visit. Today those barriers are gone, but there are still limits in place. Now, the last area is on voting rights.

So, the whole point of CRT is to share various forms of oppression, various stories, and various perspectives. That’s what it’s all about.

Alex: That’s very reasonable to look at this. Do you think it would be good if deaf schools or mainstream programs with deaf students included CRT in their schools? Do you think that would be a positive thing?

Reggie: That is a good and sensitive question, ha ha. To be perfectly honest, I would say yes, it would be nice for schools to include CRT in their discussions, especially if they have a high percentage of BIPOC students. It’s because — I’m speaking in facts, not opinions or feelings — this is a fact — a high percentage of teachers in the U.S. are white. So of course, what a white person sees and experiences does not apply to the BIPOC experience, which is different. Their beliefs are different from their beliefs. So sometimes they will view something as cruel or not acceptable. This does not only benefit teachers, but it also benefits students, because it helps students understand their identities, especially if their families do not sign. That means they do not know their history. So, that kind of thing.

Also, I’ve noticed that if a governor decides to ban (CRT), I recognize their white fragility. My sign for it has different meanings. White fragility (weakness), white fragility (being behind), white fragility (ignorance). I feel like when they see the words, “race,” they immediately think “racism!” and are concerned that it will cause a division. But really, when I read about it, it actually exposes and allows people to know what’s going on. But they are afraid that if they find out about what they do, it means that they must “hate” white people. No, they just need to know their history, know who they are. So I think that’s important. That’s my feeling.

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Alex: Do you want to add anything? Maybe I didn’t ask a question, but do you have more thoughts about this topic of CRT?

Reggie: All I can say is to have “the talk.” Research and learn. Just because you have experience — it doesn’t necessarily mean you’re right. What’s best for you is not the same as what’s the best for us. Really, you need to know your history. Be open-minded and learn. I’m open-minded myself and I wonder why they think that way and I find out. I learn why they act that way, that their family does that. It helps me to understand so we can get along. So with this book, the last thing it explained is that their goal is not to throw out racist behavior, their goal is to throw out ignorance. They do not want people to be ignorant about history. That’s the goal of the book. And they really want people to move on and get along. That’s the whole point of the book. To not be ignorant and spew insults. No. They want you to understand, move on, and get along. That.

Alex: That’s the point. It’s the opposite — CRT’s goal seems to improve unity, to get along, and to improve things for the better, while those who are opposed to CRT seem to want things to remain the “same,” maybe they don’t want unity? I guess I have to talk with someone about why they are so opposed to CRT. Because I don’t really understand that reasoning. I don’t see what’s the big issue with CRT. It seems very beneficial. I just don’t get it.

Reggie: Like I said, if people are so opposed to it, I assume that it’s possible they don’t read. It means you don’t know your history. So they will say whatever they feel. Like, for example, I’ve met some people who literally said I’m a racist. That racism is fake and that it is not real. I hear it on the TV all the time, on the radio, all the time they feel it’s not real. Until they meet someone in person, if they meet me and hear my experiences and stories, they will say, “Wow… That’s racism. That’s racist. Oh my god, I feel so bad. I didn’t realize that happened.” Why? Because they are showing their white fragility. They never have to worry about any kind of oppression. So they are shocked. So, it’s different.

Alex: You have to have more knowledge. So that’s the whole point of CRT, to give people more knowledge. I get it. I really appreciate your time, Reggie. It’s very clear. I’ve really benefited from this conversation. I really appreciate it.

Reggie: Thank you.