Interview with Dr. IV Mirus about HCQ
THE DAILY MOTH:
Hello, can you introduce yourself again and where you work?
DR. IV MIRUS:
Hello, I’m Dr. IV Mirus. I’m one of the emergency medicine residents at the University of Rochester here at the URMC Medical Center in Rochester, New York.
THE DAILY MOTH:
I’m curious about your views on a controversy last week from a video posted by “America’s Frontline Doctors.” They were doctors in white lab coats who spoke in front of the Supreme Court. They said hydroxychloroquine, which I understand is abbreviated as “HCQ,” right?
DR. IV MIRUS:
Yes, HCQ.
THE DAILY MOTH:
They said it was a cure! But that Big Pharma, the government, well not the government but that big corporations were in a conspiracy and also that face masks are not necessary. The video went viral. It was deleted several times. What is your view, since you’re on the front lines yourself?
DR. IV MIRUS:
Well, I mean it’s frustrating. Because I know that HCQ is not enough for a cure yet. That group, the Frontline workers, I’ve never heard of that group before. I did some research on them and saw that one or two of them were eye doctors or surgeons. One of them has already retired. I have a lot of respect for eye doctors, for sure, but they will be the first to tell you that they don’t work with the coronavirus. They are eye doctors! Also there was a female, I forgot her name, but she said HCQ was a cure, and that we don’t need masks, as you said. That’d be great if that was a cure. I want to know, I need to know. We want to use whatever is the best option for a treatment for Covid-19 patients. But if they stand on a soapbox and yell that they have a cure, and try to get attention, that is not helpful. I can’t use that information. It’s no good. I can’t rely on one person who is standing up and saying, “I have a cure. I’ve seen it on firsthand experience. You should use it!” I can’t experiment on my patients. I won’t prescribe that medicine until we have sufficient evidence that it is effective. To give you a better idea, as a comparison, suppose you are buying a car. You’re looking around and you are approached by two salespersons. One is from a well-known brand such as Toyota or Ford. They have reliable cars that have been built for many years. The other is a new car that you’ve never heard of before. They want you to buy their car. Okay. So if you ask about the safety rating, how many stars they have out of five, what the MPG is, whether it runs good, how many times it has broken down, whether it’s frequent or every once in a while, whether they will fix it if it breaks down, do they have a warranty, these are good questions you should ask before you purchase a car, right? Now, with the other person, you’ve never heard of it before. If you ask about a five-star rating, seatbelts, airbags, they might not give you a response. They don’t have a rating. They might say, “Oh, you don’t need it. 100% of the time our drivers said it’s safe. Even if there’s an accident, they are safe 100% of the time.” It makes you wonder. No rating, no MPG. No paperwork. No data. It might make you suspicious that something is not right.
You don’t want to buy a car that might break down immediately. You know that Toyota or Ford are reliable and safe. It’s the same thing when I prescribe medicine. I need something that is reliable and safe for my patients. I can’t say, “Oh that looks good,” and prescribe it. I can’t, I need more evidence. So they are standing up and talking about HCQ as a cure, that they don’t need masks, my advice is to ignore them. It’s a waste of time. It’s not the first time it’ll happen. This will happen again and again.
THE DAILY MOTH:
Trump has frequently talked in support of HCQ. We know that he is not a doctor or a scientist, but has the power as a president and he used his platform, but Dr. Fauci and the federal level, the NIH, what they say don’t align. It has become a mess. Scientific issues are now political issues. Does that make an impact on you? Do patients come in and ask for HCQ? How do you handle that?
DR. IV MIRUS:
Well, President Trump, regardless if you support him or not, he is the leader of this country, right? Whatever he says, people will trust him, sometimes. You see that Dr. Fauci says that HCQ doesn't work. There are many studies and published research that’s come in that says, “Well, there’s not good evidence right now.” It seems like there’s a conflict. That’s a big problem in science, you don’t politics to have an effect because it will then influence data, and you can’t trust it. Then what do you do if you don’t have good, reliable data? There would be no direction. Where is the cure? We don’t know. You have to stick with the process that we’ve used for many years, the scientific method. Research, publish, re-test. It’s worked for many years. We need to stick to that. Try to ignore the rest. I know it’s hard, but yeah. My patients, if they want HCQ, I simply say, look, there’s not enough data. There’s not enough evidence. I want a cure. I want to prescribe something that will cure them completely. But as it stands right now, I now that HCQ is not working. Period. There are published studies from independent research groups that have come in. I do let them know that there is a “HERO” research study at Duke University that is looking at the outcomes if HCQ is prescribed early. Okay. I’m curious and I want to know. But as it stands right now, there’s no proof that it works. I don’t want to give something that I know doesn’t work. The patients typically understand, they appreciate a better understanding. They accept it and we don’t have arguments.
THE DAILY MOTH:
Do you mind if you share your viewpoints on schools reopening this fall?
DR. IV MIRUS:
I think if we look at our city of Rochester, here, the case numbers are going down significantly. We have a very strict mask and social distancing policy. That’s why cases are going down. It’s working. I saw my neighbor walking outside with a mask on. He doesn’t have to, but he still wears one. That mentality is what leads to case numbers going down. So when you talk about reopening schools, well, schools will reopen in two weeks. That’s a bit too soon, there should be a postponement, but we have a better chance to go back to school as opposed to the south, such as Texas or Florida. They are going back to school, that’s a big risk. They haven’t controlled the spread yet. They want to go back to school? The policymakers in the state have to be mindful and aware that it’s a big risk. They haven’t controlled it, but cases are declining here. That’s an easier conversation to have. It’s hard to say, it really depends on the area. If you have better control over case numbers, then that’s a good discussion to have, whether to open schools or not.
THE DAILY MOTH:
I appreciate your time. Do you have any final comments or anything general that you want to share?
DR. IV MIRUS:
I mean, I just know that everyone wants go back to a normal life. It’s frustrating. People have lost their jobs and all the other things. They are very difficult to deal with. But if we want to go back to a normal life as fast as possible, we have to continue with social distancing. We have to continue to wear masks, until we find a good, proven cure. Pandemics are a part of nature and a part of life. This is not the first time that we’ve seen a pandemic and this will not be the last time. So we should prepare and learn from mistakes happening now so that in the future we won’t repeat it. It’s important to learn from things that happen now so we don’t do it again in the future. Right now, just be patient and stay the course. It will go away. Just it will take time.
THE DAILY MOTH:
Thank you, Dr. Mirus. Thank you for all you do.
DR. IV MIRUS:
Always good to see you.
THE DAILY MOTH:
Take care!